Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Doormaster »

I think you're putting a lot more trust in them than I do

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Brekkjern »

Well, I do put more trust in them than anecdotes on a forum because they are generally made up of word searches from newspapers, books and the internet. It means it's based on actual numbers and statistics rather than just "something you experienced" and thus something has to be true.

I'm sorry that I actually have some faith in the scientific method (which dictionaries tend to lean towards) rather than blindly following a stated opinion.

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Riku »

Whoa whoa there, slow down, turbo (no, not you, Turbo). Chin was the one who mentioned that he is fully aware that anecdotes are not definitive evidence for an argument.

Don't forget that observation is part of the scientific method. And observation varies in different settings. Dictionaries do not always reflect regional differences.

So keep your daisies panties on, and everyone remember not to attack each other. Or so help me God, I will pull this thread over.

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Brekkjern »

Sorry. I did not mean to offend. I have been at work for 14 hours straight doing tech support. I just wanted to put my opinion on paper in a short and concise way.

And when it comes to observation in the scientific method it isn't in the way we normally think of it. There are two thumb rules when it comes to science.
  1. Don't get fooled
  2. You are the easiest person to fool
If you follow those two premises, you will find that your experience isn't worth much. All observation in hard science is done by measuring things. As an example, I can say that my road to work is "long", but by actually measuring it we find it to be X meters. No matter what we guesstimated, it would be wrong and the ruler would be much more correct.

The same thing goes for this argument. Dictionaries are created by counting the usage of a word, and then matching them up with the use cases. When a sufficient amount of usages are found, the definition is added based on the use case. Most definitions in a dictionary will be correct in general usage.

The point I am trying to make is that if you can't trust something where people spent hours upon hours scouring what litterature humanity creates, then what makes our few limited experiences back when we were 8 years old in elementary school more valid?

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Doormaster »

I'm not saying dictionaries are useless for that kind of thing, but I also don't think they're by any means comprehensive, especially if the definition you're talking about isn't an official one.

For example, I looked up Dog in three separate dictionaries, and not one of them described it as being a term for a male friend. I've heard it being used in this sense several times, both ironically and sincerely. I think it's actually used in that sense to a much greater degree than the term 'bossy' is used as primarily referring to girls

Again, I'm not saying that dictionaries can't be used in the way you're describing, but I also think they can be pretty limited since language changes on such a frequent basis

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Reyo »

While empirical evidence is much better than observational evidence, there is still the point that empirical evidence wouldn't even exist without initial observation. Plus, a dictionary is meant to be based off of society as a whole anyway. It's supposed to be that the dictionary follows society, not the other way around. Of course, using that to say "Well then I should talk however I want to and they should change it on a whim!" is just ridiculous since it's an observation of how society works as a whole that determines what's put in the dictionary, not each individual person. You're a part of society, but you're not greater than society.
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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Barabba »

Is it gay if a guy goes out with a girl who has a dick?
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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Riku »

I would imagine that depends on how the people involved feel.

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by The Nightman »

I think that if everyone knew the girl had a dick, then most people would see them as a gay couple, but for the couple themselves they would go by whatever they think it is.
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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Vax »

If the girl identifies as a girl and the guy identifies as a guy and they are romantically involved then that right there is a heterosexual couple regardless of dicks. If you want to get into the nitty gritty about whether the guy is attracted to the other person's femininity or their dick or whatever, I think it's important to remember that labels, in the grand scheme of things are kinda meaningless. I don't think it's necessary to try to quantify what's gay and what's straight and who's attracted to what and who and why. I' a firm believer in the idea that anyone can have romantic feelings for anyone else under the right circumstances. There are bonds that people form in life that are far stronger than what we deem the average coupling, so I think that, rather than trying to put all these sorta of relationships into different boxes with different labels on them, we should concentrate on how these sorts of bonds push us forward as humans.

So in short naw I don't think it's gay whatever.
Or, y'know, whatever.

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Cori »

I'm reminded of that video where this person was standing in a box labeled 'gender' and says, "What should I do? I don't fit in the box!"

And then another person walks past them and says, "There is no box!"

Like, my point is that if you feel like you need to have a label for yourself or your relationship in order to be content, then fine, use a label, but you shouldn't stress or worry if you can't find a label that fits your exact situation. It's silly to try and alter your life just to cram yourself into the requirements of a certain label. Live by your rules, not a definition.
Last edited by Cori on Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Turbro »

Cori wrote:I'm reminded of that video where this person was standing in a box labeled 'gender' and says, "What should I do? I don't fit in the box!"

And then another person walks past them and says, "There is no box!"

(about 1:44)

Relationships between people attracted to only one gender and people who are transgender haven't really happened enough to have an agreed upon term, so it's all really just subjective. Personally I'd go off the gender identities, and say that it's a straight couple.

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Crushter »

I think the "gay" debate should be finished and assimilated before an even smaller minority attempts to take priority.

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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Cori »

I'm not sure what you mean by that. Would you mind clarifying?
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Re: Taboo Topics (Heavily moderated)

Post by Crushter »

I see too much informational shit clogging news networks and media etc about trans whatever lately. Personally, I really don't give a shit what you call yourself or your genitals, and I really don't think you should take that business to work. However, I can understand wanting to fight for an equal level of acceptance in a wider society that plainly, really doesn't care. But I think this "informational clog", might just override any progress gay culture has made. While stories aren't fact or numbers, I've seen lately that if we can call it one, "the Trans movement" has begun to bully it's way either into, or above the current movements created by gay communities. America by and large has just now started to strong arm politicians into letting them have their rights, so is there really a need to bully your way in? Couldn't that have a harmful effect not just on your allies, but your own cause?

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